PM's New Pets

[PonyMama]

Ok a friend of mine got gifted these critters, and after only a week they didnt' like them because of the one eating crickets.  So I decided I woudl take them, but had to search the internet and figure out how to care for them.  So what are they?  A Fire Bellied Toad and a Fire Bellied Newt.

Original owner made them an aquarium but no lid and gave them no land to live on, and they were liek this for 2 years.  My firend got them and gave them some land and plants, but still no lid.

They also didnt' have lighting, Calcium or anythignt hat was really required ot keep them.  I am slowly going to gather all I need to make sure they have a great life, but for now they sit in two tupperware containers, because their new habitat had not been sealed properly so it leaks.  My hubby went te go trade it for one that does not leak.

Here is what their old habitat looks like:



I will try get pictures of the actual frog and newt when they go into their new habitat tonight, but as you can see by the old home, the new habitat made up by me will be 10X better adn they will have a good life with me, since i am givign them things they need, like heat and light and proper food care.

[PonyMama]

My daughter just named them
Newt- Katie
Toad- Tracey

[Goddesss]

You can see the little newt and froggy in there.  Cute names. =)

[PonyMama]

I am going to upload a bunch of new pics, they are in their new home and happy, exploring, and it is better suited for them.  now i need a second one so they can not live together

[Tribe]

Oh wow i totally cant believe they live in piece with each other. Thats so neat.

I had a firebellied frog & firebellied newts when i was  younger. They lived for quite a bit though i do have to say the newts got kinda stinky at times. I dont know if that was because there was multiple ones or what.


Im still trying to adujst to the ferret now abiding in my home but i think hes becoming a little more a lazy but then i figured he would be..he sleeps in little home in his cage most of the time and i let him out to be a nib when hes up and about.

[Tribe]

As far as seperating them go..if theyve lived together for 2 + years i think they may get rather sad without friends. Id go get another toad to live with the toad & another newt (though that i know of most commercial pet stores dont sell them any longer) for the newt

[PonyMama]

No they have to separater, as they secrete different toxins, and the toad is starting to be a bit of a bully since they live in a shiny new enviroment that better suits them

Just uploading pics now

[Tribe]

I take it the first owners didnt do the whole seperater thing huh? that shows your purchase any animal you should have to pass a test. Cant wait to see there new shiny home!

[PonyMama]

Not a great pic of their new home but not bad either


The toad who my daughter named Tracey


and she is a bit of a bully now that they are in a home where they both want to move around and explore

the Newt who my daughter named Katie




and no the petstore said they could live together, and believe me I was told that by each of the petstores as well

[Tribe]

Tis confused..i thought they needed to be seperated because of the toxins each of them secreted? i didnt think i was okay to mix any type of species with another. But i guess thats bias to me as i had a bunch of snakes at one point (when i was younger) and i had a friend who had like 3 snakes all in one huge 100 gallon tank (though they were all small it didnt seem okay) she had i think a two corn snakes and ball python in one tank..of course snakes are a little different then a frog and a newt XD

The newt badly makes me want to go to west virginia. I use to go every year up until last year, i was the biggest nerd and kid out of all the little ones that went the year before last. There are salamanders in those parts that you can catch quite easily. There are the ones who grow skinny and very long (commonly mistaked as snakes acutally) then there are the ones who think that need to claim stake in the cabin that are about as wide as a small womans wrist and as long as your hand end palm to the tip of your middle finger XD

Edit:Wow i do adore those tanks. I was once considering one for a pixie frog i fell in love with at petsmart however my hubby said no to the frog...hes not reptile friendly

[PonyMama]

yes that is why they need to be separated.  and as soon as I have another $70 I will get a second one adn they will be separated, but I wanted to limit the stress for now and keep them together.  But he newt will be in the original tank for the time being once I get it washed otu and make a mesh lid, they are likign their new home though

[Tribe]

Oh wow, which one did you get. The small one or the larger one? the small one would be plenty enough for a newt i would think..its um $50 from where i am i think at most for sure (though to stock it up with everything needed i guess it would be about $70. I wouldve needed the larger one for a pixie frog and then of course the package for it was outragous so i just said no to the whole thing even after the hubby decided no (it was i think $40 for the frog, $70 for the tank & $30 for the froggy package that went with the tank) For that i decided a ferret was a way better idea.

[Tribe]

If you can find a wide flat rock that has an opening just small enough for the newt to slither under i promise you they love them. I had a bigger tank for my newts..um i think 26 gallons it was (i had three though) and i filled it with sandy gravel (a mixture of the gravel and sand you can get at petsmart) and a couple neat rock like caverns i found at local pet stores and i like to never seen the little buggers theyd get under or in those rocks and stay for ever.

[PonyMama]

I live in Canada so my $70 is about $40 for the US, but this is the smallest of this kind you can get here, and other stores have them for $120 which is stupid.
I was looking at all sorts of things for them but just couldn't afford it today, I hoped she wouldn't give them to me for at least a month so I coudl gather everythign then poof she was here with them

[Tribe]

I didnt know there was such an exchange rate us to candian dollars. but i think they only come in two sizes one is rather small (well not rather small just small to the big one) and the other is rather large theres not a happy medium to those tanks really XD

I think the poor little things would adore you for just giving them a proper home anyways. Most people who buy those frogs & newts usually stick them in those little plastic tanks with the handles..the ones that are supposed to be used for transporting and a temporay situation.

And yes 120 for a tank that comes with the little back wall and thats it isnt really wort a whole 120 although they are the best on the market for those kinda pets no doubt!

Though i must say have you seen those biorb fish tanks..those are way beyond reidiulous...someone stuck a gold fish bowl on a black ring added a lid to the top that matched the bottom then put one of those middle bubble filters in a tube and said there is an awesome tank now lets charge 10X what its worth..really

& another highly expensive horridly horrid thing ive seen with animals of this such is this new drawf frog craze..have you seen them in canada yet?

They stick two poor little dwarf frogs in a tiny betta like tank with a piece of bamboo and supposidly self cleaning rocks (they say they are live rocks O.o) and then charge between $30 & $45 for them depending on the store..not to add to the badness of this but one i could buy all of that for around $15 at wally world..i know those rocks dont clean themselves because my cousin got one of those little froggy set ups for chirstmas and it finally got the point i got tired of seeing them suffer from nastiness that i broke the lid from the tank (this company had glued thier lids to thier tanks) and bought them a new tank..now i have to visit every so often to make sure the new tank is cleaned...and they say these little frogs can live off of 2 little tiny pellets a week..youve got to be kidding...

sorry to get off topic it just really boils me that just because a animal is little and very inexpensive people think its okay to stuff them in less then okay conditions and leave them like that forever.

[PonyMama]

from what I saw there were a bunch of sizes, there were some that were only mesh and others that hung from the roof for temporary housing for snakes as well.

i think they will enjoy life at our house, even my hubby who said these are yours not mine took pity on them and bought their lighting

i will have to see those fish tanks

[Tribe]

Ill get a picture of a few of them for you XD

And i totally didnt know there was more to that tank line then the front opening ones ill have to take a look at them for future refernce!

[Tribe]

Okay lets see biorb orb tanks


There is three sizes
Baby biorb 4 gallons is 79.99
Biorb at 8 gallons i think is 129.99
Mega biorg at 16 gallons is about 200.00 give or take

then they came out with the square biorb


8 gallons is between 229 & 294 depending on your color.

then theres the rectangle at 16 galllons

$394

and oh wait a 12 gallon rectangle at $324

The sphere

9 gallons
$134

Now these do come with filtration and such but from what ive heard it sucks. They have a light yes but no heating system (though they recommend there larger tanks for salt water fish..are you kidding me)

[PonyMama]

pretty but i would never get one, too expensive

[Tribe]

Ya id never even think of it..they are rather i dont know on the silly side.

Theres a neat glass shop here in town that can get me a tank of the same size (shape and all) for about 1/4 the price and i can do my own filration/heating system for way less..

[Goddesss]

They look very happy in their new home =)

[Soup]

Hello.  This is Karasu from PI.  I signed up here just for this topic, because I wanted to give you a bit of advice.

Toads and newts should not, under any circumstances, live together.  The newt produces a toxin which will poison the frog over time, it also releases a lot of ammonia and waste into the water, which the frog will absorb through its skin.

They should be kept separate, for both their healths - you don't want to come home to a dead newt or dead fbt - just as Hunni said.  I see you have a nice new Exo Terra tank - did you keep the old tank they came in?  Until you can afford a new tank (exo terra are the best in my opinion!) could you move the newt to the old tank (which will be comfortable enough, if not snug) for a short amount of time?  I would also recommend a Vivarium (like the exo terra) as opposed to an Aquarium, like the bio orbs.

What kind of lights do you have on these guys - they also like quite differing temperatures - do you have a heat mat/heat lamp?  What temp is your house, how long is it on?  Things like that.

I have been keeping frogs for the last 4 years, so I do have some personal experience.  I understand if you would all rather I didn't post on here, and you are welcome to remove my account should you wish - but I do want you and your girls to get as much joy and the longest lifespan out of your two new pets.

(As an aside, the frog is called Tracey, I am called Tracy - I had to post SOMETHING! <3)

[PonyMama]

I got all this info from Unconventional on PI too, and becasue they apparently have not been together 2 years but in fact 4 years and when i got them they were stressed, to the point they hardly moved int he orginal tank I hav placed them together for just a couple days, while I put together a lid on the tank they came in and set it up properly.  I ran out of funds as I got only a few days notice and thought I was going to get a month at the very least.

We bought a UVB light for the awake/sleep cycle for both of them, and so far the tank is a little warmer then room temp, but the toad is hiding in the moss under a plastic plant keeping warm.  We do have a heat ligth too but I won't use it until I split them us becasue I know the newt does not need a heat lamp.

My newt does not actually like going in the water, as they living in water only together for 4 years, but they do get misted by me 2 times a day to make sure they are both nice and damp.

[PonyMama]

It is critical though for the lid to be made so that the newt does not get eaten by a cat (as I have two), and I have to wait until sunday to go buy mesh to make that lid

[Soup]

It is critical though for the lid to be made so that the newt does not get eaten by a cat (as I have two), and I have to wait until sunday to go buy mesh to make that lid

You might want to try with a glass lid at some point too - I know my cats love to plonk themselves on top of Hiro's tank and warm themselves heee!

Also, I think your friend has put you in a really really crappy situation, just dumping these guys on you - seriously, sometimes I think there should be some sort of test you need to pass :/

[PonyMama]

I agree.  Some people should not be allowed to take on pets.  I had to learn as much as I could about these critters in two days.  People think hey they shoudl be easy but in the first day of owning them my hubby and I sepnt $160, and we still don't have all we need for them, like the calcium and the blood worms (since the newt doesn't seem to liek the newt food, although it is eating the small crickets for me)

I am trying my best in such a little time.

I thoguht about glass but then the spot I have picked for the tank the cat's don't go there, as  woudl beat them (nto really but they would get watered), so I think a mesh/screen top until I can afford another Exo terra tank is fine. 

I will be doing this separation asap becasue I knwo they need to be separated, even though all the petstores here say they are fine together becasue they are both fire-bellies.  I told eahc and every one of them that they need to be seperate becasue of toxins and they told me that was myth, so I said and they live in different climates, that shut them up.  They are hapier though, they climb and bask and everything.

My home is small so it stays pretty warm and snug, but the toad will have her heat lamp as soon as I get the newt out.

Oh by the way cute about the Toad having the same name, my daughter corrected me and told me no E so it is Tracy

[Soup]

Yay, thats the best way to spell Tracy! <3

Seems you are pretty clued up - sometimes I laugh at the people who work in pet stores.  if there is a herpetology shop (snakes/Newts and thelike near you) then I would certainly speak to them.

Theres also a pretty awesome form called Talk to the Frog - they are just a MINE of info - I always find them easy to talk to. 

The problem is with the commoner frogs, like FBT and newts, they are so cheap, people think they are pretty disposable and can live with minimum effort.  It makes me ;_;

If you decide later down the line, that you are interested in getting another frog, then let me recommend Whites Tree Frogs.  So easy to keep, get really fat and squishy looking, and they call them the smiling frog <3

[PonyMama]

ok I do have a small question though, frogs and toads, they are more nocturnal right?  I have noticed her sleeps most fo the day and wakes up after the light goes out?  or coudl this be that I need a lower wattage of bulb?  I have a 26, and I was sure that was on the very low end of the scale for what they need.

I will check out the forum of course, that is great.  and cheap or not it is still a living creature, this is why you can't go buy a child from a store, some people are stupid.

White Tree frog, I will check it out, sicne we have the setups, I am sure we will get something new if these ones go.  They had dismal care for way too long and I am not too sure if they are going to live the full lifespan.  I hope they do though, they deserve that much

[Soup]

Yeah the FBT will be nocturnal - not sure about the newts but I am pretty sure they are too.  How often are you feeding actually, and what size are the crickets - they should be no larger than the space between the FBTs eyes - they are greedy buggers and will try to eat anything (including pinkie fingers!)

I hope, now they will have proper care and be seperated, that you will get a lot of life out of them - if they are both eating and pooping then I would say you are AOK - if they are too stressed to eat then you would have issues, but it sound like you have coaxed them both to take something.

The light should be on about 10 hours a day right now, at the very very most, 2-3 crickets every 2-3 days.



(also I was looking at the old setup - please don't use those fish pebble things - if they pick one of those up and swallow them they will get impacted.  Impaction = death.  I see you have them on sphagnum which is excellent, along with eco earth or any other cocohusk alternative.  It usually comes in a dry brick which you rehydrate.  Kinda like soil but more reptile/amphibian friendly)

[PonyMama]

Yep they will both have what they have now for the floor, which is the block of forrest bedding.  I don't like the aquarium rocks, but if that is all I had I would have no choice, but I do so I won't be using them.

I knew about he cricket sizes, but the petstore told me they eat 2-3 2x a day and that seems a bit much but I have been putting 5-6 (3 weeks crickets) in once a day, adn they seem to not be dying and are gone, so I am certain they are being eaten, as I have to check becasue I need to check for stress, and no appetite.  But they do seem to be eating them I just don't see it.

the newt loves the forrest bedding, I even dug it out a hidey hole and it curls up in there and sleeps, right now it is curled up under the same plant (or close to it) that the toad is under.
I will be moving the palnt to the front of the tank thoguh so I can keep a better eye on them, without touchign them, since I can't wear latex gloves and they shoudl not be touched and handled.

[Soup]

Yeah, the toxins can irritate peoples skin.  I am sure the newt will love the forest bedding, it'll stay nice and damp, just like they like it.  I would reduce the feeding - they will get very very fat, very quickly, and you may find the crickets are hiding in the sphagnum/forest earth.  They can do that.  The other problem is, crickets will nibble and bite your newt and frog, which gets infected quickly and nastily. 

I would start bringing them down to once every two days - and keep an eye for poo.  Poo is the most important thing for you to see at any time.  Poop = happy frog and newt

[PonyMama]

Ok will feed every 2 days and see how that works., not too sure what I am lookign for wen it comes ot what poops for these looks like but know they are stressed, 3rd home in less then 30 days, but at least less stressed then before, as they actually move around.

[Soup]

I can tell you frog poops look like little pellets - they are pretty easy to spot and usually in the water - frogs like to use the water for pooping in xD

[PonyMama]

I got to change the water tonight, so I will have a quick check.  I may even take the lid off and have a really good look inside without moving them too much. Poor things.

[Soup]

Oh, you might want to put dark (or brown at the moment would do) paper around 2 sides of the tank (if your exo came with the "wall" on the back)

Good luck! <3

[PonyMama]

really?  Well I will go hunt down some construction paper then, I shoudl have brown or black, I think the brown would match the "Faux wall" better. 
Why do I want to do this?  Just curious, and trying to learn the proper care for these guys as you can tell.

[Soup]

The dark makes them feel more secure - like they are closed in, and it stops outside factors from stressing them too.

Its really handy - I mean you can get some lovely printed laminated paper stuff for the back, which is a bit pritter fro later, but it will really help them both settle in and stress a lot less.

[PonyMama]

ok well I will definitely find them soem dark paper to put along he sides for now.  If it will help with stress, then I will help

[Soup]

I hope everyone is doing well today   Find any poop?!

[PonyMama]

I did not, which has me a bit concerned, but maybe I am really unsure of what to look for so the water is really clean and I will check it in the morning again.

I checked under the plant and they are both still under it.  The newt comes out every once in a while, the toad I have not seen otu in a coupel days, but it did poke it's head out this morning when I was covering their tank sides

So could a drastic enviroment change put them into shock?
Or maybe I should clean the tank and move the plant they are hiding under to closer tot he front so I can see what's going on?  I have no idea, I am trying, adn I refuse to handle them if I dont' have to, since I am allergic to latex

[Soup]

No, don't clean or move anything.  That will just stress them even more.

I say at this point, cover them up with the construction paper and leave them alone for 2 days or so.  They'll get more adventurous soon.  Just make sure they are getting enough heat (or the sort of middle between the two) and clean water. 

[PonyMama]

Yep new water will be daily.
I will cover their tank as best I can and maybe use the heat lamp slightly so put a little more heat in the tank, it is warm but not too warm, more geared towards the newt I am guessing, but still leave it covered.

I am guessing still throw some crickets in just maybe fewer or what?  I don't want to starve them, but don't want the crickets being in there and possibly attacking them if they are not eating.

[Soup]

When did you last feed them?

They can easily go 2 or three days without being fed and no adverse affects.

[PonyMama]

Day before yesterday, so this would be day two

[Soup]

Well, how are things with you then?

[PonyMama]

I think what I see in the water was poop, it looks like sand, but not the right color.  I guess is how I would describe it.  the newt goes exploring and finds other places to sleep, but the toad, she is still hiding.  I will be feeding her again tonight so I will see how that goes.

[Soup]

Yeah, the poop if it was in the water overnight will kinda fall apart, good signs!

The toad may simply feel intimidated by the newt, or she does what my Hiro does - he has his favourite place to sleep, he stays there all day, and you would think all night - only way I can tell he's been up and around while I was asleep if the trail of eco earth in the water

[PonyMama]

ok good sign then. 

I think the toad just feels comfy there, becasue she was popping her head out today, and is even now half hidden half visible.  The newt again is wanderign aroudn at times and exploring, and then she goes back to share the hidey spot with the toad

[PonyMama]

ok so finally the toad came out of hiding, and even ate a cricket for me to see, so I think we finally have a point where she is no longer stressed.  Even during the day when she normally hides she hid only slightly.  So I think we are good.  The newt still doesn't go in the water, but I mist the cage a couple times a day to keep her moist

[Keeper]

Just found this info on newts because i remember having normal ones in our ponds whn i lived at home. They love the deep water. XD

When the fire bellied newt reaches adulthood it can either return to living permanently under water or semi-aquatically, living partially on land, depending on their surroundings.
The terrarium should be approximately 2/3 water and 1/3 land (pebbles, gravel and rocks). Make sure that the land slopes into the water so that it can be accessed easily. The water levels should be at least 4 to 6 inches deep, giving your new pet room to swim and aquatically.